Friday, 19 April 2013

Who are we?


In the 21st century we have discovered that we need to know where we come from in order to know where we are going (cliché, I know but it’s the truth). Have you ever tried finishing something without knowing where it all started? .....

Well that’s the problem the “Msenti clan” is faced with in this day and age we are all trying to explain who we are without knowing where we come from, thus most of us don’t even know who we really are!… so join us in “the journey of the Zaca clan”, as we try to uncover our past, celebrate the present and prepare for what the future holds for us

First step we need to complete the missing pieces of  our family history.  Be it you are Zaca, Jaca, Msenti, Khethaphela, Nomafu, Nzaca ,Malimela, Nomafu, etc as long as you come from the Ngcanga lineage join along and help us and the future generation to discover who we are by uncovering the past.
 
All suggestions other than comments may be directed to the following family email address: msentinovuka@gmail.com
Looking forward to your comments, suggestions and support!!!!

60 comments:

  1. this is the begining of great things!

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  2. There is still so much that I still need to learn and understand about my origin, and I believe this is the perfect platform for me to do that. Interacting with all the Msentis is gonna make this even more interesting great job boMsenti!

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  3. Wow! Looking forward to meeting more family through this site

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  4. This site is a great idea guys, lets make use of it by commenting and asking questions,in that way we will be able to get as much info as possible from comments by people who know more than we do. Let go for it!!

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  5. I can see the light now about my roots....

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  6. We are so happy to see so many people showing interest in this blog, thank you! Your contribution is important to the family. Mdu Jaca you are right there definetely is a light at the end of the tunnel.

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  7. My first question where do we belong Zulu,Bhaca or AmaSwazi?

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    1. There's no clan that is called Bhaca, different clans were running away from wars then people called them amaBhaca, unfortunately the name stuck. Thina singamaNhlangwini we spoke a Swati dialect. Remember inkosi uMelizwe Dlamini I think ikomkhulu lakhe was in High Flats.

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  8. ey tnx ma bru dat iz what i wana knw coz whn ppl ask dat am i a zulu n i dnt knw dat 2 say coz um rly confused

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  9. If we do a propare reseach will know the truth.....

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  10. mdu from what we know we are originally swati people who came to south africa to hide (bhaca), and thats when we got the name "bhaca"...... and because of our on going contact with other cultures we cannot say we are Zulu or Xhosa because most of us practise the culture that we are mostly exposed to, but we are still doing reaserch about our history and where we come from, we will however get back to you when we have concluded our research. we would also appreciate it if anyone knows anything to let us know.

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  11. Msenti ngyabonga for that feedback with a positive direction...

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  12. yaz guyz abant bebeth ngIKHOIKHOI ngob beth isbongo samaKHOIKHOI beth akekh umunt onalesbongo

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    1. Haybo batsho njan ukuba akekho umntu onesisisduko, ingabo aba. Noba singavula iwhatsapp group sitsho sibe yimbumba

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    2. Badingwa ukushaywa labo abathi sama Khoikhoi mina ngizoni qalela ngu msentei Kay 1

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    3. 😂😂😂 as for being Khoi-khoi.

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    4. Mina bavele bathi ngiyi pondo

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  13. Batshele sphume ukuthi inkaba yakho iseswatini. Bangazogeza la bona

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  14. Thina omsenty omalimela nginenkinga guys ngifuna kuzazi zonke ithakazelo zakithi help me out

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  15. I'm 20 years old and I'd really love 2 know my origin, I know that I'm originally from Swaziland, I also know that some of our people went into the xhosa areas therefore some are xhosas koda I'd really love 2 classify myself under something, I get 2 durban I'm classified Xhosa, I get 2 my hometown I'm Zulu

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    1. To say that you are of Swati extraction does not mean you come from Swaziland. AmaBhaca were part of the Zulu Nation of King Shaka and bazithutha ngoZulu umabezibiza. My theory on Msenti would be:
      Msenti = Mseinti = Msingenti = Msingendia = Msingenthia = Msingo + Ndiya/Ndwa/Twa/Mthiya or Singo Twa as opposed to Mthethwa who is Mande Twa (Mthethwa).

      The Singo = Singa = Sai or Shai or Soi or Shoi/Sho (These are the Langa Zulus who lost with Zwide and ran for cover in other provinces and other countries. More importantly, though, AmaBhaca make up a large proportion of Zulus (today) together with AmaPondo, Wushe and Thembu, especially around the heart of Zululand - all tribes of Swati extraction, even if only partly. So, we must be careful when we speak about AmaBhaca as if they are only the ones who ran away, many Bhaca stayed and became the Zulu nation as we know it today.

      The word Bhaca is a hybrid of 2 seperate people of a common ancestor, Solo/Zolo or simply Zulu, who combined a long time ago = Bha = Bhayi = Mbai = Pai (thina OZwane singamaPedi or OVezi, so we are also called Pai - UZwide was married to a Zwane woman so my people ran to ZamBIA, eZampedi or Zambedzi amongst other African countries) = Bailly (pronounced Bhayi, in places like Ivory Coast) = Mambai = Mamba (which is used for Ngwenya = Kwena in middle Africa but is how most Zulu people interact with their history as the Bhayi people) + Ca = Cwa = Qwa = Kwa = Kua (AmaKua are descendents of the Sibiya people and exist as the Ngwane/Tswa Tsonga/Tswana/Zwane/Zwa people of SA but google Makua/MaKwa or simply Kwa tribe and you will see every African country has them) = Ngwa. So Bhaicwa then = Bhaca.

      Now the Swati people are called Asuati in the DRC all the way to Gabon, as part of the Mbuti people which we call Phuthi or Phuthing or in true Zulu, Mpunzi - njengeMpunz' edle mini - I think oSkhakhane labo - it means Skhakhane, a Zulu surname, is Phuthi of Dlemini - which is the Pondo-Mpondomise-Xesibe people's ancestors. The Asuati is also called Aka or Baka or Bayaka or BebaYaka. Bhaca by definition then also = Baka = Swazi. We also call Baka, Mphanga like in Mpangazitha or Phaka as in Phakathwayo = Baka Twa - praise names for Zulu heartland tribes that were the basis of the Zulu state.

      A lot of Zulus, I mean a lot of people who call themselves Zulus, are actually Bhaca or Swazi or Masango or Singo. So, the question to ask oneself is what is a Zulu or Xhosa etc. Also the Singo or Svingo are the Kings of all Southern African tribes including all South African tribes. For instance, Zibhebhu KaMaphitha (Mbatha or Mbai Twa), himself led the Mandlakazi faction of the Zulu Royal Household fought with King Cetshwayo or Cetshwa/Cekwa or Qekwa and Cetshwayo won (there are some Zulu Xhosas who praise themselves with Cetshwayo and pretty much all Zulu Kings, so the history is deep). Soon after, King Mphephu of the Singo now rules the Venda. The ruling house which houses the Lemba is called VhaSenzi, they have Gona people with them. Some remnants of the Mandlakazi then became the Tswana of Mafikeng, Botswana and Namibia and some became Mhandla Tswa people of the Tsonga in Mozambique first and now they have pretty much moved back to KZN. But the Venda King is still a Zulu: Mphemphu Ramabulana - Mbemvu or Mbambo or Mbai-Mbo - also isiduko sami esinye.

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    2. One last aside: Bhai is also = Bhinga or Binga (which is Zulu Hlonipha language speak (uma ukhuluma nenkosi KwaZulu awulokothi ulibeke elithi Zulu in proper address and respect but we have gone astray) for Zulu or Heaven or sky), so technically AmaBhayi or Port Elizabeth people of both black and coloured races are actually Zulu by definition. A lot of Pai/Bhai live in Limpopo as Pedi (they admit their Zulu heritage - pretty much every Pedi I have met says they are Zulu) and in Botswana as Bakgatla who are AmaLala-Nkosi (called Pokomo or Mphankomo or Mbai Nkomo or MbaiKhoi (Nkomo = Khoi) = Mbango - who is listed as an ancestor of the Zwane people who are intermarried heavily with Hlubis and Ngwanes through their kings - that's why Hlubi and Zwane praise names have some similarities - Zikode (Lingode/Ziroda or Ziko + Dei = ZingoDinge/Dike), Nsele - which is actually Nseleka (Nseleka Ndebele or Barolong - Southern Sotho who partly became Pedi and Zambians, Zimbabweans, Tanzanians etc.) Linda (Litja or Dika or Likwa or Dinganga or just Dinga - Southern Sotho who mixed with the Pondos - they still live as both Sothos and Zulus around KZN, Lesotho, Free State and Eastern Cape) Mkhonto - Khoindo = Nkomontu = Ngwato/Gando (Main Batswana tribe) people and the main and strict Xhosa tribe as in Gcaleka and Rharhabe (they are also Zulu, because Ngwa/Kwa people are Zulu and so are the Tho/Nto/Ntu) birth line - excludes all the Zulus who speak Xhosa and live in the Eastern Cape according to King Shaka split story, so a Bhaca is a Zulu and not a Xhosa, strictly-speaking, a Thembu is a Zulu as the main Thembu house is in eQhudeni in the heart of Zululand - asizukuva ngamaThembu eskqhela kakubi ngokba athi wona they exist before uShaka before Zulu - Uma uzalwa nguZulu unguMzulu, bangoMzulu because of heritage, not uShaka - check iziduko zabo nomlando ufana ncamashi!), Hlubis (Moshweshwe, Ian Khama - Botswana Main Chief and first president and other South African Kings and Chiefs were Hlubis/Shuping/Shubi) are Zulu.

      Back to you, Msenti, your surname tells me that you are Singo/Singoni/Singozi/SiNkosi (Nkosi = King = Lion (Kituba) = Ngozi (skin-wearers amongst the Pokomo in Kenya). This is a large group of people in Africa. In Cameroon, for instance they even have a tribe called Mambo/Ngwe/Nkosi/Ekossi. In Kenya, you are called Pokomo or Ngozi or Gusii. In West Africa and locally you are called Kisii or Mkhize - Mambo-Nkosi-Ngwe.

      The word Nkomo comes from: Sibiya ngezinkomo, abafokazana bebiya ngamahlahla meaning Sibiya = Nge (Ngwe/Ngo) + Khomo/Khomu/Nkomo/Khoi/Khingo (the last is using the rule that Nyai = Nyika) - now you can see where Cingo, Qingo, Qiko, Ciko etc. come from. AmaCoi, Qoi/Qhoyi, or Choyi - Like uKagiso Dikgacoi who is DingaCoi/Dikacoi or DingaCingo. In continuing, the Fokazana = Bafokeng or Bafok or Bafingo/Mfengu or Mafikeng or amaFikeni (AmaQwathi - the Lesotho and Free State Basotho are mostly AmaQwathi/Qadi/Gadi/Khali/Khadi/Mngadi/Kgadi - Omnguni AbaKhulu!! Njengani OKHALImeshe) (ONgwane but the Hlahla or Shasha or VhaHlengwe or Mabasa/Mabaso or Nwa'Nathi type, nakuBarolong amaHlahla agcwele - AmaTsonga or AmaSoka = AmaBuka = AmaPhunga = AmaPawu = AmaMbau = AmaPhalu = AmaPhalo - basically all Zulu, Xhosa, Venda etc.. come from the same ancestor - No difference - just apartheid propaganda)

      Zaca = Jaca and Zaca = Zaicwa = Zingacwa which is basically the same analysis as above. Nozinga + MaCwa/MaQwa or MaCwa = DingaCwa. The Dinga ruled with their King Dingaan or Dingane. When he was killed then the Bhaca and the Mpondos lost power,e specially, after losing the war in 1879 at eSandlwana. Dingaan was killed by his own relatives in Swaziland, while in exile. His brother Mpande or Pate, is the one from whom the current crop of Zulu kings come from.

      Zaca = Nzinga/Nzai/Nzwai + Cwa/Qwa/Kwa/Ngwa/Tswa.

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    3. VhaSenzi + VhanGwa (or VhaNganga or VhaKwakwa or VhaKrakra or BaHaha or Balala or BaDla or BaTla or BaJa) + VhaGona = BaSenza + Nga + Khona = Senzangakhona = Singo + Ngwa + Khona tribes from which all other tribes came. Khona = Kwena = Ngwenya = Gona. Simply put, Kwena is the main Royal Line of the Ancient Great Kings of Zulus that ancient books are written about. Kwena is written in its true form: Elioenai or Oenai or Oenika or Gawena or Gegana Ndebele.

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    4. Izibongo zakwa Zaca kwi-website: www.Wakahina.co.za:
      Zaca
      Ethnic: no ethnic edit
      Add Clan Praise
      Clan Praise(s)
      Zaca Msenti, Nomafu, Mkhethaphela, Z... | IsiZulu (Zulu) : created by: Mthobisi Sithole Zaca
      Thursday, 24th May 2018
      zaca msenti, nomafu, mkhethaphela, zondwayo, ngwekazi, solwa, nina mageza ngobisi abafokazane begezangamanzi, mbacomfofu ophuma eswazini, jaca, nzaca, malimela owalimela amadoda ngenkomo ezimbili kuya kwezintathu, nina enakha endleleni ngoba nisiza ababulawayo, bathembhu ababulala itibane kwangabandaba zalutho,...

      Zaca,Msenti,Malimela Mkhethaphela,Zo... | No Language : created by: Jeffrey Sthembiso Hlela
      Monday, 14th June 2010
      Zaca,msenti,malimela mkhethaphela,zondwayo nina enakhe endleleni ngoba nisiza ababulawayo

      AbaKwa Jaca on the same website:
      Jaca
      Ethnic: Nguni
      Add Clan Praise
      Clan Praise(s)
      Msenti,Malimela,Mkhethaphela,Nyembez... | No Language : created by: Nesh Jaca
      Thursday, 20th September 2018
      Msenti,
      Malimela,
      Mkhethaphela,
      Nyembezi, (Nyen = Mali = Madi = Nyan, according to West African Mali empire, Mbezi = Vezi = Pedi - the Pedi are Zulus, that is where Zambezi also comes from but more importantly, oNyembe = small house of Tembe, zi = Zwi = Tsi/Si as in half of Nsinde/Tshidi - oNdawo-Sibande-Mathe)
      hlalabemzonda bethiwonile namhlengenzanganto

      Msenti ,Mkhetsaphela. | No Language : created by: Nceba Masangwana Masangwana
      Saturday, 6th September 2014
      Msenti,
      Mkhetsaphela. (Mkhethaphela, Khetha = Geda = Khwethwa or Khwe/Ngwe + Thwa + Phela - Inkwali yeNkosi or AmaGwayi = Peila = Phikela (my praise name - nginguMungwe - AmaPhela = AmaBhele azala uZulu)

      Mpandla,Kipa,Mbona | No Language : created by: Unknown...
      Friday, 24th April 2009

      Mpandla, (Phahla - Sonke singo Luthuli/Ntuli njengamaZulu - isiDuko esingaphezu konke ngaphandle kukaNdlovu/Tlou/Zhou/Zuu/Juu/Sono/Chobi/Jobi/Njobvu/Nobu/Ndovu/Ndu (as in Shandu or Shah Ndou)/Ndou etc. Mpandla = Mbai + Dla clans a big Zulu clan that combines the Mbai/Bhayi/Bha and Dla/Tla - Phahla)
      kipa,(Giba = Gwiba = Gwi/Aggi = Barolong/AmaLolo/AmaHulu/Huru/AmaHlunu/AmaKhulu)
      mbona (Bakgatla tribe called Buna/Bona - Bakgatla = amaLala or Mpangahla/Mpangalala)

      Website addresses:
      http://www.wakahina.co.za/listings/j/surname/jaca
      http://www.wakahina.co.za/listings/z/surname/zaca

      I would not be shocked if kukho o-Daca no Thaca or Thwaca or Setwaka etc. It is all a variation of the same name ngezigaba zeSintu. Uma isithetho or isikhulumo or ulimi lwehlukile nokuzibiza kuyehluka. Futhi uyakwazi ukushintsha ibizo lakho libe yisiduko noma isithakazelo sakho. For instance, njengoMangethe, Nsele, Linda, Mkhonto, Cebekhulu, Phikela I can call myself any of the above, officially, and it will not be frowned upon. Every Zulu, Swazi and Mangwe know this is the case, mos.

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  16. With regards 2 the KhoiKhoi situation iv heard that as well though I don't resemble a KhoiKhoi but iv heard that we do have ubuKhoi within us is there any truth 2 it?

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  17. A wise man once said, "to know where you are headed, it is imperative that you are clear and not doubtful of your origin", yesterday me and my sister Nokwazi Zaca had the priviladge of meeting one of a few fathers that we still have left that know much about the origin of the Msenti Clan. Yes i say the Msenti Clan because he shared that Msenti was the eldest, he also shared with us the tree that is believed to have everyone who uses this surname. allow us to research more on this and we will share the information as soon as we gather enough we will also need your input aswell to update our family history so our children will not be in the dark like most of us. IMINI enhle bompindela kanobafu, bo msenti bo malimela.

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  18. Siphumelele Harvey Jaca8 September 2015 at 05:55

    Ewu bo Senti ngiyabonga any findings so far with our origin let the light shine @ at end of tunnel I am long waiting with the exact ethnic group I will proudly say Ngili Swazi noma Zulu noma Bhaca noma Xhosa

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    1. SingamaNhlangwini siyatekela njengemaswati uma sikhuluma sikhonza koDlamini thina yibona amakhosi wethu.

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  19. mina ngathanda ukwazi ukuba zakhe kuphi izizukulwana zabo Novuka, Sqwayi, Lujiva, Bhokweni, Mlumbi, Mbabala, Jojo coz thina isizukulu kaTshani sikeMzimkhulu [Readsdale,File,Ngele,Gugwini,Mbulumba]izigodi?

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    1. Ngicela kuvela mina ngo Mlumbi...isizukulwana sika Mlumbi siningi kakhulu ngapha eMzimkhulu endaweni yase Lukhalweni...lapho afikela khona uMlumbi Wanda khona...abanye manje ubathola kwaNjunga, Rocky Mount,eMagogo, kwaFile, nakwezinye indawo njengako Meyi..abanye kuthiwa baphindela eMkhomazi lapho avela khona uMlumbi sebesuka khona eMbumbane

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    2. Ngicela ukubuza Jaca ukuth uzalwa ubani uTshani?...cz ngasuke ngeva ngath bayelamana noMlumbi

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  20. @ Isaac Jaca oNovuka bakhona eMatatiele kwaMakhoba nakwa Mzongwana, abanye abakhona oWondeni Tshazwa Ngoqo and Jazi

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    1. Oh wow, I had no idea that kukho ooWondeni eMatatiele; although I should not be. I just had no idea that there are People using my great- grandfather's name as a surname. UWondeni was my grandfather's father. He had three wives and my grandfather is the son of his middle wife. We use the surname Novuka. If anyone wants To know a bit moe about specifically indlu yakwaWondeni and I guess his brothers i.e. Wondeni's brothers, get In touch and I Will put you in touch with my dad and my uncle, who would love To have this conversation. What'sApp me on +358404649622 or snovuka@gmail.com

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  21. ngyabonga baba kuhle ukwazi ngempela abantu abangasebenzisi uJaca ngoba sikhula nje siyintsha siye singayinaki indaba yomlandu.

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  22. kuhle ukubon oMsent abanye and I'm very proud to be a Zaca no matter what and most people don't know our surname but I kwow that we are blessed to be oKhathaphela .And now I know why I have a a lot of haters coz nguMaZondwayo.

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  23. This blog has changed my life. I've always dreaded the question of "khawuzithuthe". My grandparents are from edikeni (Alice), my surname is Valtyn (Afrikaans) isiduko sam nguJaca and I've always had a challenge going forward after uJaca noMalimela. I will forever be grateful because now I know a little bit more about my clan. Thank you so much guys.

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    1. I think we are on the same page because my grandmother's surname is Valtyn but in our generation we are Faltein no longer Valtyn and sithi singooJaca, Malimela, Ntlangwini, Sdoyi, Khuze. Sibalikhulu,....

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    2. Jaca, Malimela kuyahambisana isthakazelo sethu, kodwa uNtlangwini is our clan, Khuze is also our clan Sidoyi was a king of our clan and Sibalukhulu isithakazelo sakhe uSidoyi.

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  24. Hi bomsenti abahle,I'm from Bizana Eastern Cape and ekhayakhulu kukwa Mzokwana Matatiela. I just was to say as well that I'm greatful for this blog/website that I've came across about out origin and our roots.

    It's saddens me all the time of how little I hear of our Surname and most people look at me twice when I tell them I'm a Jojo Msenti especially here in Durban where I'm based. Most of oJojo that I come across boSnama from Mount Ayliff and abroad and some sengathi akukho buhlobo obutheni kubo. So if there are any Jojo's around Durban I would love to know them together with thier families who knows we might be blood related.

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  25. I also have so many questions ngemvelaphi yami but ngyabonga ukuthi ezinye izimpendulo ngizitholile Lana ikakhulukazi izithakazelo

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  26. Are we Swati or Zulu, I would like to talk about what is reality ngikhathele ukuthi ngiyibhaca manje

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    1. Ngokutshelwa ngabadala thina empeleni singamaNhlangwini, amakhosi amaNhlangwini oDlamini, oSibalukhulu.

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  27. Ngu cela ukuhlangana nabantu bakithi 0640448913

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  28. I'm Novuka by surname but I know that I'm jaca clan. I'm from matatiela kwamakhoba but I spend most of my time here in Durban. Living in matatiele lead me to do a tradition yabesuthu yokwaluka Infact the whole family.

    I grew up emaxesibeni Mount ayliff. Mshana wakwa Ntuli. I really want to know my origin.

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    1. Siphuma khona Ccza uma ngizwa kahle but theres more to it

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    2. Nam ndingu Novuka, umtshana wakwaNtuli eMtAyliff. Do I know you Zakhele? What'sApp me please on +358404649622. This is beyond interesting....

      Looking forward To your message!

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  29. Hi,mina ngintobikazi ka Jaca.Bengithande ukubuza isidulosethu.
    Ngoba utata wa sweleka kodwa ubethetha isiswati sibuya Emzimkhulu

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  30. Mhlekazi umJuda, lw mvelap bendiyi funa uyibhentsisile. Qha yi English le inokumaendlelen enkosi Bawo

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  31. sibuya eSwatini umlando Cc

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  32. Hi guys, nginguMalimela waseThekwini and kwithakazelo zethu baphatha oZaca, Jaca, Mvumbi, Masikane, oMsenti bathi abesushwana, abehla ngesilulu abanye behla ngeladi. It's been said that baningi oMalimela that are Sotho/Pedi apparently there's even a Chief yakaMalimela just outside Seshego

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  34. Hello guys, I need help about learning about Lujiva, okwezithakazelo and a bit of history if kukhona anikwaziyo ngyabonga

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  35. Wow thanks guys about clarifying Indaba yemvelaphi yakoJaca I really appreciate your help thanx a lot

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  36. Mina ngifuna ukwazi imvelaphi yethu kodwa ngiphila ngibatshela abantu ukuthi mabethi bhaca babechaza ukuthi omkhulu babaleka eSwatini bathola indawo babhaca khona okusho ukucasha,duzane nakwaXhosa uzwe ke abantu bakithi sebekhuluma isixhosa abanye,bafethu singamaSwati thina boNomafu

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  37. mina ngicela ukwazi zonke izithakazelo zami ngokulandelana kwazo

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  38. Greetings ko Msenti. Kuyintokozo ukuthi kube khona leli page in this time ukuze sifunde siwazi umlando wethu. Ngidabuka e Mooi River and currently based eMtuba they really don't know my surname this side.

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  39. Molweni bo Bangushe, ndiyabulela ukuba emva kweminyaka ndizama ukuba sikhe sidibane singo Ntshane. I ve tried to contact ooMsenti from Gauteng province and KZN in Mzimkhulu and some of us in eastern cape in Alice and other cities. I also heard the we have our own president or chairperson in Petemartsburg but i lost their WhatsApp group. I Sandla Mdingi from eQumanco Cofimvaba eastern cape

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